Friday, 28 April 2017
8th edition thoughts
8th edition is well and truly on its way, there is no denying that. I could go over everything that has been published in the last week or so, but I've read over half a dozen blog posts all covering g the same ground. So i thought that I would do things slightly differently with my take on the new 8th edition. This post will basically cover the main points I have, whether they are issues or praise, but also look back over the little run of posts I did a week or so ago, about what Id like to see or expected from 8th.
Now, I usually like to get the negatives it of the way first, so I will and surprisingly there are currently very few of them. My biggest gripe so far though is charging, or more specifically, the fact that the charger goes first. I have always thought that the current system needed some adjustment, but on the whole did alright. The new system just doesn't sit well with me, from a game play view, its very simple, too simple, and from a fluff point its just rubbish. Ok, an ork charging a guardsmen maybe able to get the jump, but a howling banshee or wytch? So now my charging guardsmen will be able to surprise those genesteelers or the group of khorne dogs. It just doesn't sit right with me yet, hopefully it will make more sense when weave the full rules, but right now I think its a change for the worse. On other thing about combat that worries me, is with the release of some example profiles the have gotten rid of initiative values, so what will happen in subsiquest rounds of combat? Who goes first, the charger still or the player whoose turn it is? I guess some of the AoS players will be able to answer this one.
Another change for the worse, is getting rid of templates. Now I understand why they are doing this, but it seems to be based primarily around tournament players wishes. It also leads to some odd situations, as in one game I had a platoon command squad with 4 flamers attacking 1 bloke, as that was the only available target. Naturally, I got 4 hits and rolled to wound, but with out templates? I might have missed, assuming your going to have to hit, or might have got 12 hits, assuming d3 each, from 4 weapons shooting once each. Then there is the fact that does this mean that flamers will now be able to shoot through their own troops without penalty? At least that means I can hide my flamers at the back now.
Edit: why, oh why, do you do this to me GW? So I spent some time writing this on Wednesday, only for GW to release an article on weapons, one of which was the Flamer. So it will in deed be a d6 hits, which automatically hit a specified unit, and you can inflict multiple wounds on a single model. So, with the PCS I could get 24 hits, all on one model, which seems a bit silly. It so indeed mean I can hide the flamers in a unit, but with only an 8 inch range, they'll still need to be near the front.
The other issues that if I fired a large blast at a vehicle, I could also hit the squad next door, as in real life when the shrapnel goes everywhere, but does this mean that the shot will only hit the vehicle and nothing else? So no cleaver positioning of templates to think about, no calculated risk about how close to shoot? Also no punishing an opponent for bunching up his squads. Oh, and then there are things like artillery and my precious wyverns. How will these work? Pick a target and only hit them, even if there standing in the middle of a mass of troops? I really need more info on this, as its really not clear to me yet what will happen.
The final thing that has me worried at the moment is really a basic one and I hope will be cleared up quite quickly, and thats the role of flyers. Now with Death from the Sky's, flyers got a whole lot more complex and there were a whole lot of rules added, rules we chose to ignore, but what will they be like now? Will my vendetta be able to forfil it proper role of aerial sniper and what will become of the valkyries MRP's with the changes to templates. Which has raised another question in my mind as I type. Will template weapons now be able to hit flyers? Obviously they can't now, but with no templates? Is there anything to stop my flamers from toasting hell turkey? Or my mortars from downing a storm talon?
So, really its not all doom and gloom, far from it. A lot of the stuff coming out about 8th looks good. I like fact that save modifiers are back, plus hopefully BS and WS modifiers. Movement values are good to, takes me right back to my early days of 2nd edition.
But what does this do to my thoughts about the various imperial armies I run or plan to run? Well, the big one is that the codices are not going to be what they were. Ill still look at picking up various ones, AM and BA for sure, maybe even the MT and DA ones, but they ate not going to be the be all and end all they were. The other books, whatever they will be called will take over there, the 5 of them to start with. But what will the 5 be? Marines, chaos, elder, non-marine imperials and other? That does leave a lot in the 'other' book, but I don't believe they would split up factions across books. Plus there is talk of new races, maybe even on launch, here's hoping for dark mechanicus and evil Tau (as in 'for the individual' ).
Hopefully with this new setup it will help with a few weaknesses within some of the current codices. I assume that guard, scions, sisters and the like will be in one book, possibly with the mechanicus, and as such there maybe options to mix and match things. In terms of actual units, the guard might be one of the bigger winners, as quite a few units are overpriced or under supported. Ogryns are the first that spring to mind, as do rough riders (assuming they will not be removed sometime soon) but this may also help things like sentinels and the various chimera chassis vehicles, both of which have armour 10 and are very prone to massed bolster fire. The same goes for the Russ variants, and front and side armour is excellent, but rear is useless. So won around toughness value should help.
The blood angles should be helped by the new charge rules and if they keep many of their other rules/chapter tactics, then they should be able to play as they should. The Dark angles will also get a lift with 2 wound terminator's but we'll have to see what happens with bikes. The ap modifiers will be a bit annoying for them, as the willno doubt be a lot +1 or +2 modifiers out there. Although, if a lascannon is only +3, there may not be many, as this would still give a 5+ save, something they didn't have before.
The two big worries I have aboutmy armies though is that I'm painting up my Knights and the Hjaltland are finished. If there is to many changes, theres going to be quite a bit more brush work to do. Then there is the fluff. I wonder if I'm going to have to change my fluff, again, to fit the new FOC.
Well, this is starting to turn in to a rant so ill end it here and there really is only going to be one way to find out for sure, but we might have to wait over a month for that one!