Tuesday, 19 September 2017

Hrossey yeomanry vs admech

I played this game a few weeks ago but its taken me a while to get it all typed up. The game itself was a a mealstrom games, Deadlock, played at 1000 points, on the standard deployment map (dawn of war?)

For this game I decided to try out some vehicles, namely Pask in a LR Punisher, a Leman Russ battle tank, a hell hound and two chimeras each containing a commissar, a platoon commander and a vet squad, one with 3 meltas and one with 3 plasmas guns.

My opponent was playing mechanicus and came with 2 tech priest dominus, 2 dune crawlers, one with the big Neutron laser thing and one with the Icarus array. He also brought two squads of rangers, one with plasma caliver and one with the sniper rifles, lastly he brought some infiltrators.

Both of our warlords took the resilient survivor warlord trait.


The board was set upand we rolled for deployment. I got first drop and we deployed. Surprisingly I managed to finish deploying first,  which is a rare feat!

Turn 1

Cards - 14,15,24,33,46,55 - Secure objective's 4 (x2) and 5, Defend objective 3, Domination, Psychological Warfare
scored - 14,24,33,55

The cards were good to me for my first turn, with three of the objectives easily reachable. I was already sitting on objective 4 and 3 was easily reachable in the centre of the table. While the hell hound moved to secure objective 3 in the centre, one of the chimeras also moved out to sit on another objective, objective 6, just for good measure, while Pask sat tight on objective 4. In the shooting phase, only the Leman Russ and right hand chimera were able to shoot, targeting the Rangers in the top right hand building, the big one at the top of the picture below. This resulted in a couple of casualties, enough as it turns out to cause them to fail there morale test, netting me another point. At this point I decided to discard Domination, as it would be difficult to achieve.

Moving up to take objectives

The dead pile on the left

Cards - 12,13,23,32,34,61 - Secure objective 2 and 3 (x2), Defend objective 2 and 4, Kingslayer
scored - none

For my opponent the cards were less helpful. Objective 2 was across my side of the board and I was sitting on 3 in the middle of the field and Pask was sitting on 4. Plus he'd have to kill of Pask to get Kingslayer, not an easy task these days. He moved up with the centre of his forces and the Dune Crawlers did some damage, but the main threat this turn was the Infiltrators, who dropped in near to Pask and then charged in, doing some damage but loosing two members to overwatch in the process.

AdMech forces moving up

Infiltrators drop in and......

.......Charge in on Pask

Turn 2 - score 4 - 0

cards - 15,22,35,52,54 - Secure objectives 2 and 5, defend objective 5, Blood and guts, Area Denial
scored - 54, First blood

After a good first turn, the cards weren't so kind. With both objectives on his side of the table, although, with some manourvering I could have achieved more. As for blood and guts?  Well not much chance of that. Anyway, Pask fullback from combat to free up the infiltrators for shooting and be LRBT did its thing, making short work of the squad, although annoyingly one was left alive. I also completely messed up on objective two, forgetting about it and moving the chimera in the wrong direction. The other chimera dropped of its commissar at objective 6, just to hold it in case in came up on the cards.

The guard continue to push forward

Cards - 12,13,23,32,61 - Secure objectives 2 and 3 (x3), Defend objective 2, kingslayer
scored - 13,23

Again, my opponent struggled with his cards, mostly due to the game type. Having not achieved any cards first time round, he was forced to discard a card and then had to retain the rest. This time however he was able to move forward and take objective 3 in the centre of the field, mostly by weight of numbers over my hell hound. He was also unlucky with targeting Pask, reducing him down to just a coupe of wounds and to his lowest level. The final infiltrator decided to charge in on Pask and see if he could finish the job, but was gunned down on overwatch, even hitting on 6's, 29 shots is still a lot of shots.

Turn 3 - Score 6 - 2

cards - 15,22,35,45 - Secure objectives 2 and 5, defend objective 5, Supremacy
scored - 22,45, Warlord,

I continued to gain points with so decent cards, being able to secure objective 2 easily and also gained supremacy, I was unable to secure or defend objective 5 as my chimera tried to advance in to range but came up an inch short. In the rest of the turn I managed to eliminate the central ranger squad, with a combine firepower of a hell hound, chimera and Pask. This was mostly due to the fact that the hell hound didn't perform very well all game, hitting well below average all day.

Chimera on the right failing to take the objective in front of it

The Rangers behind the centeral building are eliminated

cards - 12,42,53,61 - Secure objective 2, Behind enemy lines, No prisoners, kingslayer
scored - 53(1),61(3),WL

This was a great turn for my opponent and really put him back in to the game, with a bit more luck he could have pulled in to the lead. His hard work targeting Pask paid off with the Warlord finally being destroyed, in addition the laser armed dune crawler made short work of the chimera near by, reducing it to molten slag in no time and in the resultant explosion the platoon commander was slain. This meant that he claimed warlord and kingslayer (for 3 points) but was also able to gain No Prisoners, although he only manage to roll a 1 for the points. In an effort to maximise the turns destruction he tried to charge in one of his Tech Priest Dominus, his own warlord as it happens, unfortunately out of all the overwatch that managed to hit, it was one of the Melta guns, which promptly incinerated the priest before he could charge.


No chimera or platoon commander for that matter.

And now, no Tech Priest Dominus

Turn 4 - Score - 9 - 7

Cards - 15,35,44 - Secure objective 5, Defend objective 5, Mission Critical objective
scored - 15,35,44

At this point I was pretty confident that I could deal with what was left of the enemy forces or at least I could win the game, with only the two dune crawler, both of which were still on full health, a Tech Priest Dominus and a couple of sniper armed rangers on the board, he was going to struggle to compete on maelstrom points. I decided to focus on eliminating the last of the rangers, doing so with the LRBT, which also fired at the front dune crawler, chipping off a couple of wounds. The vet squad that had been dumped out of its chimera, went after the rear dune crawler, destroying it easily with their three melta guns. I was also lucky with the cards, with the melta vets easily being able to secure and defend objective 5 this turn and the hell hound sprinted back to get the Mission critical Objective, which turned out to be objective 4 in my deployment zone.

Mopping up operations

Cards - 12,25,36 - Secure objective 2 and 5, defend objective 6
scored - none

With only two units (for a total of 2 models) on the board, it was going to be hard for my opponent to do much. The cards were not easy, as I held all the objectives in question. So he decided on a bit of a risky strategy and targeted the chimera with the dune crawler before charging in and also performing the same tactic with the Tech Priest on the vets. This time the Priest didn't take a melta gun to the face, in fact he managed to get in completely unharmed. Both combats resulted in dead lock, the priest did manage to take out a couple of vets, but with the commissar around, they weren't going anywhere.

Last stand of the Mechanicus

Turn 5 - Score 12 - 7

cards - 26,51 - Secure objective 6, overwhelming firepower
scored - 26,51

Now there was little that I really could do this turn. As it happens, the commissare that I dropped off at the start of turn 2 finally came in handy as he had been sitting on objective 6 for 4 turns, doing nothing, but now he picked up an easy point. The vets were locked in combat and could probably hold their own with the commissars help, but the chimera was not going to cut it in combat with the dune crawler, so I decided to disembark the vets and then the chimera fell back from combat. Now we couldn't find anything to say that this wasn't allowed or that the vets then couldn't shoot, I might have missed something in the rules, but its sounds fair to me. Anyway, the vets jumped out and supercharged their plasma guns, on the orders of the platoon commander that is, and as a result, the Dune Crawler was vaporised in a giant ball of plasma. On the other side to the field, the commissar charged in to the Priest, striking hard and doing damage, to which the vets added, finishing off the Tech Priest and with him, my opponents army.

Now you see it

Now you don't. The tech Priest can just be seen before his demise at the hands of the vets.

And with the death of the Tech Priest the game ended. Although I managed to table my opponent, on the maelstrom points I was also in front, with the points being 14 to 7 at the end game. If my opponent had managed to last until the end of the game, with only two cards available, being two from the three objective cards he had, he could not have made up the 7 point deficit. I think the only real game changer would have been if the vets could not have fired after getting out of their chimera before it fell back from combat, as the dune crawler would have survived to the end of the game. 

From my perspective I think that I played the game pretty well, I did forget about the tank orders at the beginning and by the time I did remember it was a little late as Pask was dead. The list performed well though and I was surprised just how resilient vehicles have become these days, they really are strong and durable, just like they should have always been. Although I still think that some of the rules around cover are far to over simplified.

Saturday, 16 September 2017

Northern invasion 5 thoughts part 2

So, just in case you didn't read the last post, this follows on from my initial thoughts about my 1000 point army. However this post will be about how this post over at the Warhammer 40k Blog changed my way of thinking quite dramatically. Now, the post in question was a bout building a 12 command point list (or 14 with the inclusion of Creed) for 1000 points, which was just perfect timing for the tournament, even though sadly I wont be able to attend.

The list in question is based around the max min theory or maxing out on minimum sized/priced units, and then building from there. Now for his final list, he includes a number of units that I do not own, namely Yarrick, Bullgryns and Rough Riders (although I would love to own some rough riders). As such I have modified the list slightly to take in to account the fact that I don't own these units and also to take into account my own play style and needs. so what did I come up with?

2x Company Commander w/ Boltgun
Tempestor Prime w/ Power maul and Command rod

Inf Squad 
2x Inf Squad w/ Autocannons
2x Inf Squad w/ Grenade Launcher
MT Squad w 2x Meltaguns

2x Commissar w/ Bolt Pistol
MT Command Squad w/ Plasma Guns

Fast Attack
2x Scout Sentinels w/ Autocannon and Chainsaw
Scout Sentinal w/ Multilaser

Heavy Support
2x HWS w/ 3x Lasconnons

All for 1000 points and most importantly 14 command points, 3 for battle forged, 9 for a Brigade Detachment and 2 more for Creeds Tactical Genius.

So, that's the list, but is it well rounded? Well, I think so. There are a total of 9 orders, although two are dedicated to MT units, which is fine as there are only 2 MT units to give orders to. The other 7 will be spread across the other 7 units, so in reality, an order each. Perfect. There is a good spread of firepower as well, with plenty of bodies in the troop section to add weight of fire, plus bodies to take objectives. There is also lots of heavy anti-infantry with a number of autocannons, some mounted on mobile platforms, the Sentinels. The Wyvern also adds to the anti-infantry firewpower. There is also some plasma goodness in there for tougher targets and being MT troops, there is the possibility of some character sniping, with dropping in behind. There is also a good amount of anti-armour as well, with the autocannons doubling up for lighter vehicles, the grenade launchers can also double up for lighter vehicles and infantry but the main anti-armour is the two HWS units, which can kick out 6 lascannon shots, with the potential to do 36 wounds a turn. ok, there far more likely to do about 12, but they have the potential and they are actually less fragile than they use to be, as T6 weapons wont insta-kill them any more. Sat in cover they will be fairly hard to shift without some dedicated shooting. The squad of Melta Scions is a good backup for the Lascannons and will be able to drop in on anything hiding out of sight of the Lascannons. 

So, I think it covers most areas, the only real weakness that I can see is that there is very little mobility in the list, but if the format remains the same, which I believe that it will, were looking at objectives and kill points being the main victory conditions. This list does have a lot of kill points to give up if its done on a one point per unit basis as it was last year, but I have suggested switching over to the power points system that some other tournaments seem to use, as in you gain the number of power points that each unit costs when you kill it off. As most of the units are cheap units in terms of power points, if they go with that system, it should help reduce the effect somewhat. As for objectives, I don't think that there will be many other armies out there that will be able to field as many bodies as this at 1000 points. Nids and Tau maybe?

Now, as it stands, 14 Command Points is not huge, as there are only there Stratagems that can be used, the main rule book three, but even using a re-roll a turn means that I would have 4 points left for the other ones. Now, with the commissars I hopefully wont need the Insane Bravery one much, however Counter Offensive could be useful for getting a few strikes in first before being wiped out, as guard aren't really combat monsters. When the codex comes along, I think 14 command points will be huge, but until then its just useful. I might have to make a few tweaks to this list before I would be completely happy with it but by the time you read this I should hopefully have played a game against someone who is attending the tournament. It was supposed to be our no holds barred testing session and even though I'm not going, I'm still going for the jugular! I'll write it up in the next few days and get it posted along with my post game thoughts on the list.

Friday, 15 September 2017

Northern Invasion 5 thoughts

Well, I had planned this as a list building and critiquing post, however, I am not going to be able to attend the tournament now due to my wife's work commitments. Its a shame that I will have to miss this year, as it would have been nice to try and defend my crown from last year. Oh well, ill have to plan for next year instead.

 So, this is going to form one part of two rapidfire posts about my thought processes for the tournament. First part is the lists I was initially thinking off.

During the last week or so, when it was unclear if I would be going or not, I had looked at a number of lists and the difficulty of getting a good list at 1000 points presented itself. Now, I would usually go straight to my "go to" list of the Hjaltland LI, but recent games have shown just how tough vehicles have become and it has made the Hrossey Yeomanry list look pretty strong these days, maybe stronger than the Hjaltland, but at such a low points level its hard to get all the elements in to form a well rounded list.

I started, as usual with an infantry based list, which ended up looking like this;

Company commander w/bolter
Tempestor prime w/power maul and command rod

20x conscripts
2x squads with autocannon and grenade launcher
MT squad w/2x melta guns

Command squad w/4x plasma
MT command squad w/4x plasma

Fast attack:

Heavy support:
Heavy Weapons squad w/autocannon

Valkyrie w/rocket pods

Chimera w/heavy bolters

Lots of boots on the ground and a few vehicles and transports. The plan for this was to run the two squads and HWS at the back with creed, along side the Wyvern, to act as the base line, the ratlines would also be somewhere around. The various MT squads would stay off the board and drop in as and when they were needed or at the end to grab objectives. The Valkyrie and chiwould, one of which would have the command squad inside, would move around and take on what threats they could or needed to. Mean while the conscripts and commissar would be the main offensive unit, pushing up the board and hopefully occupying the bulk of the enemy firepower. 

Its not a bad list as far as I can see, it would gain at least 5 command points (battle forged plus creed), possibly more depending upon what formation I chose to shoehorn it in to. There is also a nice mix of weapons, with the MT packing both melta and plasma for a choice of targets. However, they are all fairly short range weapons. Yes, there are 5 autocannon and 3 heavy bolters spread throung the list, but if I come up against a vehicle heavy list it would struggle. I think that there are enough troops to deal with the objectives, and with 3 MT units being able to deep strike on turn 4 to try and take objectives, I think the list would have worked.

However, I though that i would see what an armored list would look like. Now, I took a list a couple of weeks ago, also at 1000 points, and it worked out quite well, so with a few minor tweaks, I settled on this list;

Pask w/battle cannon, lascannon and heavy bolters

MT squad

Platoon commander w/bolter
Platoon commander w/bolter
Vets w/3x plasma guns
Vets w/3x melta guns

Fast attack:

Heavy support:


Chimera w/heavy bolters
Chimera w/heavy bolters

I dropped the commissars as they weren't needed and I dropped the hell hound as it want very effective last game. I also dropped the second leman Russ and switched up pasks tank as I felt that, while a punished was good, it lacked punch. The basics behind this list would be the Wyvern sitting at the back with the rRatlings, while the rest of the force moved up. The vets would all be in the chimeras with a platoon commander each. The Valkyrie would circle overhead. This list would be hard to crack, a t6 11 wound model, 2  t7 10 wound models and 1 t8 12 wound model plus a t7 14 wound flyer. That's an average of t7 and 57 wounds, all with a 3+ save. The down side is that there are no troops and with the event going for objective secured on troops, this could be a problem. In terms of weapons, there's is still a lot of choice, a good amount of anti infantry with the Wyvern and Valkyrie, the chimeras also add some weight. Pask is the only real anti tank though, yes the melta vets can do a lot of damage, but at 12", 6" is even better. The battle cannon can do it at 72" though as can the lascannon. The MT squad is in for last minute objective grabbing, that's all, their running at bare bones just to come in turn 4 and try to hold the objective.

Now, one issue with the first list is that you are likely to always go last, due to there being a minimum of 9 drops and a maximum of 16, but realistically it will be 13 or 14. The second list your likely likely to go first, with a max of 11 drops but a min of 6, although I would be using 7. This means that the MT units in the first list would only have one round of shooting to enjoure rather than two, as with the second list, making survival a lot more likely.

Both lists have their strengths, the first being numbers, a range of firepower, both anti-tank and anti-armour, but lacks mobility. The second list has mobility and anti-armour and anti- infantry but lacks both numbers and volume of fire. 

However as I was pondering these lists, something popped up on my reading list on blogger, a post from the Warhammer 40k blog, about 1000 point lists and gave me a whole new view on things. More in the next post.

Tuesday, 12 September 2017

Other 8th ed marine lists

The last of my army list discussions is finally here. This post will focus on the two remaining army lists, the Stone Dragons and the Emperors Disciples, as talked about in the last post. Again, ill start with the stone dragons.

Rune Priest - w/plasma pistol and runic sword
Wolf Lord - w/storm bolter and wolf claw
Wolf Priest - w/ plasma pistol
Grey Hunters - Wolf guard w/plasma pistol and chain sword, Pack leader w/power sword, grey hunter w/ plasma pistol, grey hunter w/plasma gun, 2x grey hunter w/boltgun
Grey Hunters - Wolf guard w/plasma pistol and chain sword, Pack leader w/powerfist, grey hunter w/ plasma pistol, grey hunter w/plasma gun, 2x grey hunter w/boltgun
Long Fangs - Ancient w/boltgun, bolt pistol and chainsword, 2x lascannons, 2x plasma cannons
Rhino - storm bolter
Rhino - storm bolter

827 points (47 power points)

As you can see, the dragons are a bit of a mixed bag. The keen eyed amongst you might notice a bit of a difference between what was written about these guys in the last post and the list here. This is because having gone back through the index to double check the entries and also using BattleScribe, I have discovered that you can no longer take wolf guard squads with bolter, pistol and combat weapon, as per the last errata. No this is a bit of a pain, but not the end of the world, it just means that I've had to have a rethink about the force. So, out come the wolf guard squad and in goes........ Well, that's a good question, what does go in? With nearly 200 points to spare, what is going to go in the place of the wolf guard squads? I have thought about lone wolves, but even then, two lone wolves aren't the best choice, although they certainly are the cool choice. So what do i do? I will probably either run these guys with  the Disciples or with some Dagr Ormr, so I guess its better to go with a more combat orientated unit, but I want more good all rounds and just not Grey hunters. I think that my main problem right now is that I wanted to stay away from space wolves specific units, as in fenrisian wolves, thunderwolf Calvary and wolfen, not to mention chapter specific characters as well. Hopefully a solution will present itself in due course or maybe when the codex does arrive, either way there is a bit of time to decide.

Next up are the Emperors Disciples. As I mention in the previous post, these are going to be a fairly elite army, with only the captain and Dev's sitting outside the elite choices. Now, as mentioned in the last post, there is a high likelihood of a lieutenant being included within the list, probably at the expense of the company champion.

Captian - w/Combi-plasma and power sword
Company Champion
Honour Guard - Powerfist, Power Axe
Honour Guard - Power Sword, Power Axe
Sternguard - Sgt w/Powerfist
Devastator Squad - 4x missile launchers
Razorback - w/heavy bolters
Rhino - w/stormbolter
Rhino - w/stormbolter
Rhino - w/stormbolter
Rhino - w/stormbolter

966 points (56 power points)

With the current set up, you can see that there are 3 proper squads and 2 small squads and 2 characters, all of which can sit quite comfortably in the transports. While the Dev's won't  spend a lot of time in there's, it does mean that there are greater options for moving around the field, with a decent amount of redundancy built in to the list. Ideally I would upgrade a couple of the rhinos to razorbacks and I probably could upgrade 2 as things stand, but until I get around to building the force, I want to give myself some room to manoeuvre. Again it would be nice to have these razorbacks armed up with twin lascannon for some extra anti-armour punch, but that will be expensive.

In terms of the rest of the force, the plan is to run one sternguard squad and one honour guard squad together in a rhino, and then run the Dev's in the third rhino. The honour guard are there to help if the sternguard get too close to the enemy and get caught up in combat. Ideally they won't get charged, but if they do, then they will try and fall back at the first opportunity and leave the honour guard to hold up the enemy, until the sternguard can shoot again. Lastly, The razorback will carry the captain, lieutenant and apothecary, to support one of the sternguard units, depending upon who requires the most assistance. So, while not the most balanced list, it should be fun to play and also fairly easy to paint up!